Star Trek 2 “Perdition’s Flames”
Updated
User reviews
19 reviews
Overall rating
9.0
Audio/Video Quality
8.5(11)
Audio Editing
9.1(9)
Visual Editing
9.4(11)
Narrative
9.0(10)
Enjoyment
9.0(19)
(Updated: October 17, 2012)
Overall rating
9.6
Audio/Video Quality
9.0
Audio Editing
10.0
Visual Editing
10.0
Narrative
9.0
Enjoyment
10.0
There’s never enough time to watch everything… and man, are there loads of fanedits which I need to catch up on! Well, one wet Thursday evening I fancied a bit of Star Trek, and having only seen 2 of Bob’s Trek edits (of the first and fifth movies), I thought it was about time I watched “Perdition’s Flames”.
Firstly, I really like the whole concept of what Bob has done with his TV series approach to the movies. The adding of the series sound effects, music and all the fade to black ad-breaks worked particularly well in “The V’ger Incident” (a few music level problems aside), and I’m pleased to say that the case for Perditions Flames is no different. In fact, as The Wrath of Khan always seemed to feel much like an extended TV episode anyway, the classic feel which Bob adds to this edit seems perhaps more like a perfect marriage of styles this time around. Indeed, it comes as no surprise that flashback footage to the actual TV episode, “Space Seed” is utilised when Kirk realises it is Khan who is attacking the Enterprise. What’s more, it’s nicely executed too, and to me the only aspect of this edit which would make it even better would have been to try and crop the image to 1.85:1 ratio. That being said, picture quality is good throughout and the sound editing this time around is more consistent with no varying levels to speak of.
So, for picture and sound quality I would give this a solid 9/10. Great job Mr Bionic.
In terms of the story, this was perhaps the most ambitious side of the edit, in that Bob tries to tell the story very much from the point of view of Kirk, meaning that we only ever see Khan when Kirk is also present in the scene. Initially I was a bit worried how this would work. After all, some of the best moments in the film are when Ricardo Montalban is chewing up the scenery, but for this edit and its intentions, it works very well. That being said, when it comes to the heroic exploits of a certain Mr Spock and the consequences thereafter, I did feel that there was a little too much missing, even though I fully understood Bob’s intention to keep things firmly fixed on Kirk’s point of view. The use of flashbacks and new music during Spock’s send off though does not work as well for me; not badly executed, it just didn’t seem to fit comfortably for me.
Overall however, the narrative works perfectly well in context of the edit and I wouldn’t hesitate in giving this 9/10
On the visual and audio front, the editing is more or less flawless and as already mentioned the audio side in particular is an improvement on Bob’s first Star Trek edit. So, Visual editing would get 10/10, audio 10/10.
Enjoyment is, as with all Bob’s edits, the aspect which shines through the most. You can tell the amount of enthusiasm and love which he puts into the edit and I was thoroughly entertained from start to finish, as easy 10/10 for me.
Overall then, Perditions Flames continues and in many ways improves on the good work started with The V’ger Incident. If you want to see Star Trek II from Kirk’s perspective then this is the perfect way to do so and you will have a blast; that I can guarantee.
Firstly, I really like the whole concept of what Bob has done with his TV series approach to the movies. The adding of the series sound effects, music and all the fade to black ad-breaks worked particularly well in “The V’ger Incident” (a few music level problems aside), and I’m pleased to say that the case for Perditions Flames is no different. In fact, as The Wrath of Khan always seemed to feel much like an extended TV episode anyway, the classic feel which Bob adds to this edit seems perhaps more like a perfect marriage of styles this time around. Indeed, it comes as no surprise that flashback footage to the actual TV episode, “Space Seed” is utilised when Kirk realises it is Khan who is attacking the Enterprise. What’s more, it’s nicely executed too, and to me the only aspect of this edit which would make it even better would have been to try and crop the image to 1.85:1 ratio. That being said, picture quality is good throughout and the sound editing this time around is more consistent with no varying levels to speak of.
So, for picture and sound quality I would give this a solid 9/10. Great job Mr Bionic.
In terms of the story, this was perhaps the most ambitious side of the edit, in that Bob tries to tell the story very much from the point of view of Kirk, meaning that we only ever see Khan when Kirk is also present in the scene. Initially I was a bit worried how this would work. After all, some of the best moments in the film are when Ricardo Montalban is chewing up the scenery, but for this edit and its intentions, it works very well. That being said, when it comes to the heroic exploits of a certain Mr Spock and the consequences thereafter, I did feel that there was a little too much missing, even though I fully understood Bob’s intention to keep things firmly fixed on Kirk’s point of view. The use of flashbacks and new music during Spock’s send off though does not work as well for me; not badly executed, it just didn’t seem to fit comfortably for me.
Overall however, the narrative works perfectly well in context of the edit and I wouldn’t hesitate in giving this 9/10
On the visual and audio front, the editing is more or less flawless and as already mentioned the audio side in particular is an improvement on Bob’s first Star Trek edit. So, Visual editing would get 10/10, audio 10/10.
Enjoyment is, as with all Bob’s edits, the aspect which shines through the most. You can tell the amount of enthusiasm and love which he puts into the edit and I was thoroughly entertained from start to finish, as easy 10/10 for me.
Overall then, Perditions Flames continues and in many ways improves on the good work started with The V’ger Incident. If you want to see Star Trek II from Kirk’s perspective then this is the perfect way to do so and you will have a blast; that I can guarantee.
L
(Updated: September 15, 2012)
Overall rating
9.3
Audio/Video Quality
8.0
Visual Editing
10.0
Narrative
10.0
Enjoyment
9.0
Review by L8wrtr — October 26, 2010 @ 1:41 am
So I had the privilege of seeing an early cut of this and found it very enjoyable. Bob’s trademark TOS flavor was already in place, and he had gone quite a long way in creating the Kirk only point of view. At the time I quite enjoyed it but still felt that I would return to the theatrical as my go-to DVD.
After having watched the final version, I have reversed this position, this is now my go-to version.
Visual Quality
Like Bob’s previous edit, the V’ger incident this edit suffers from less than ideal video quality. There are compressions in certain reds, and it is as most who follow Bob’s edit’s know, the letterbox aspect. From a purely evaluational standpoint I have to give it a 7/10 for visual quality. Personally, this doesn’t bother me, but I do hope that Bob at some point is able to revisit this edit with improved software capabilities as this is the ONLY aspect that holds this edit back.
Audio Quality
This is one of the shining gems of the edit. Infusion of TOS sound effects and music is seamless and if you had not seen this movie before, or didn’t know what the big deal was, I suspect most wouldn’t be able to identify what was added. I could detect no hard or startling audio cuts or transitions and in particular, the sequence where the Reliant first attacks the Enterprise was handled very well. Audio levels did not seem out of line with the original DVD. I see no reason to give anything other than 10/10.
Editing
On the technical front there were no flaws, no flash-frames and no visual mismatches. Like the audio, I would say that if you were not familiar with the subject matter, or the original story a view would be hard placed to find where the Bob made his edits. His presence is only noticeable because so much has been added, modified and/or removed. 10/10
Story/Film improvement
Surprisingly, and quite contrary to my expectation, the shift to Kirk’s Point of View actually does, at least for me, makes this a better movie and a true example of Less is More. I can certainly be counted among those who absolutely love Ricardo Montalban’s performance as Khan. He has some of the juiciest lines and dramatic performances in the movie. Yet when his scenes are highly redacted, we see a classic Trek story emerge. This is no longer Khan’s Revenge. It’s a Star Trek story, which means it’s a story about Kirk, Spock and Bones, and it highlights the human struggle and issues of mortality that Kirk faces.
**SPOILERS AHEAD!!!**
Of particular joy for me was the Reliant attack on the Enterprise, and the battle of the Nebula right through Spock’s death. The way Bob was able to cut Khan’s prepatory lines from the lead-up were masterful, and the manner in which the attack came off was truly that of a surprise attack and makes it believable that they got the jump on Kirk, but even more impressive was excising Spock’s fixing the Mains – the power of the moment when Kirk looks at Spock’s empty chair is ratcheted up so much more from this angle and makes the emotional payoff of when he first sees Spock hit home even more. And the goodbye montage, much as I was against it in the initial copy I saw, worked very well. 11/10
Extras
The DVD menu is a default template and not terribly exciting (and repetitive if you’re watching more than one of his edits at a time ;) ) but I don’t mark down for menus, I’m here to watch an edit after all.
He does provide a nice little ‘About this movie’ bit that is enlightening and fun.
And as other’s have said, watch all the way through the credits.
Overall
This was a highly enjoyable edit that is a great example of what a Fanedit can be. It is one thing to take a crappy movie that missed the mark and make it better, but to take what is considered the best movie of a franchise and create something new and and enjoyable, that is truly an impressive feet.
The only thing that holds this back from a perfect 10 is the video quality, which drags this down to an 8.5 out of 10 so rounding up I give this a 9/10. This is a fantastic edit and simply a fun movie to watch.
So I had the privilege of seeing an early cut of this and found it very enjoyable. Bob’s trademark TOS flavor was already in place, and he had gone quite a long way in creating the Kirk only point of view. At the time I quite enjoyed it but still felt that I would return to the theatrical as my go-to DVD.
After having watched the final version, I have reversed this position, this is now my go-to version.
Visual Quality
Like Bob’s previous edit, the V’ger incident this edit suffers from less than ideal video quality. There are compressions in certain reds, and it is as most who follow Bob’s edit’s know, the letterbox aspect. From a purely evaluational standpoint I have to give it a 7/10 for visual quality. Personally, this doesn’t bother me, but I do hope that Bob at some point is able to revisit this edit with improved software capabilities as this is the ONLY aspect that holds this edit back.
Audio Quality
This is one of the shining gems of the edit. Infusion of TOS sound effects and music is seamless and if you had not seen this movie before, or didn’t know what the big deal was, I suspect most wouldn’t be able to identify what was added. I could detect no hard or startling audio cuts or transitions and in particular, the sequence where the Reliant first attacks the Enterprise was handled very well. Audio levels did not seem out of line with the original DVD. I see no reason to give anything other than 10/10.
Editing
On the technical front there were no flaws, no flash-frames and no visual mismatches. Like the audio, I would say that if you were not familiar with the subject matter, or the original story a view would be hard placed to find where the Bob made his edits. His presence is only noticeable because so much has been added, modified and/or removed. 10/10
Story/Film improvement
Surprisingly, and quite contrary to my expectation, the shift to Kirk’s Point of View actually does, at least for me, makes this a better movie and a true example of Less is More. I can certainly be counted among those who absolutely love Ricardo Montalban’s performance as Khan. He has some of the juiciest lines and dramatic performances in the movie. Yet when his scenes are highly redacted, we see a classic Trek story emerge. This is no longer Khan’s Revenge. It’s a Star Trek story, which means it’s a story about Kirk, Spock and Bones, and it highlights the human struggle and issues of mortality that Kirk faces.
**SPOILERS AHEAD!!!**
Of particular joy for me was the Reliant attack on the Enterprise, and the battle of the Nebula right through Spock’s death. The way Bob was able to cut Khan’s prepatory lines from the lead-up were masterful, and the manner in which the attack came off was truly that of a surprise attack and makes it believable that they got the jump on Kirk, but even more impressive was excising Spock’s fixing the Mains – the power of the moment when Kirk looks at Spock’s empty chair is ratcheted up so much more from this angle and makes the emotional payoff of when he first sees Spock hit home even more. And the goodbye montage, much as I was against it in the initial copy I saw, worked very well. 11/10
Extras
The DVD menu is a default template and not terribly exciting (and repetitive if you’re watching more than one of his edits at a time ;) ) but I don’t mark down for menus, I’m here to watch an edit after all.
He does provide a nice little ‘About this movie’ bit that is enlightening and fun.
And as other’s have said, watch all the way through the credits.
Overall
This was a highly enjoyable edit that is a great example of what a Fanedit can be. It is one thing to take a crappy movie that missed the mark and make it better, but to take what is considered the best movie of a franchise and create something new and and enjoyable, that is truly an impressive feet.
The only thing that holds this back from a perfect 10 is the video quality, which drags this down to an 8.5 out of 10 so rounding up I give this a 9/10. This is a fantastic edit and simply a fun movie to watch.
L
(Updated: August 03, 2016)
Overall rating
9.0
Audio/Video Quality
9.0
Audio Editing
9.0
Visual Editing
9.0
Narrative
9.0
Enjoyment
9.0
Review by Neglify — August 2, 2012 @ 6:38 am
What a fun fanedit this was. I never got too much into Trek but I love Wrath of Khan. It was great to watch it in a new way. Bob is the king of Trek edits.
What a fun fanedit this was. I never got too much into Trek but I love Wrath of Khan. It was great to watch it in a new way. Bob is the king of Trek edits.
N
Overall rating
8.2
Audio/Video Quality
7.0
Audio Editing
8.0
Visual Editing
8.0
Narrative
9.0
Enjoyment
9.0
The bad:
DVD is not anamorphic, Image looks funny on widescreen TVs. (I ended up ripping the DVD, cropping the image, and re-encoding a disc of my own.)
The good:
Apparently, everyone loves wrath of Khan. It's supposed to be the film that saved star trek. I was born after the classic Trek era. I grew up with TNG. The first Star Trek movie I remember seeing in theatres was First Contact.
Compared to First Contact, WOK is slow and boring (with a glaring continuity error right in the opening). It's not a bad film, it has a lot of redeeming qualities. There is a lot of dramatic irony, the plot is good, the characters are dynamic. It makes for an excellent study in technically proficient storytelling, but it was never a lot of fun for me. (Also, Ricardo Montalbán is the biggest Ham in the universe, right?)
This edit... well it made the film fun. The story moves more quickly, there is mystery and tension. Shatner seems like a great actor. What little we se of Khan makes him tolerable (even enjoyable). Also, the continuity problems have been amended.
On the whole, a fantastic edit. My go to copy of WOK.
DVD is not anamorphic, Image looks funny on widescreen TVs. (I ended up ripping the DVD, cropping the image, and re-encoding a disc of my own.)
The good:
Apparently, everyone loves wrath of Khan. It's supposed to be the film that saved star trek. I was born after the classic Trek era. I grew up with TNG. The first Star Trek movie I remember seeing in theatres was First Contact.
Compared to First Contact, WOK is slow and boring (with a glaring continuity error right in the opening). It's not a bad film, it has a lot of redeeming qualities. There is a lot of dramatic irony, the plot is good, the characters are dynamic. It makes for an excellent study in technically proficient storytelling, but it was never a lot of fun for me. (Also, Ricardo Montalbán is the biggest Ham in the universe, right?)
This edit... well it made the film fun. The story moves more quickly, there is mystery and tension. Shatner seems like a great actor. What little we se of Khan makes him tolerable (even enjoyable). Also, the continuity problems have been amended.
On the whole, a fantastic edit. My go to copy of WOK.
User Review
Do you recommend this edit?
Yes
Format Watched?
DVD
A
(Updated: September 15, 2012)
Overall rating
8.0
Audio/Video Quality
7.0
Visual Editing
8.0
Enjoyment
9.0
Review by Rogue-theX — August 28, 2010 @ 6:53 pm
This review is based on my opinions and my viewing experience. Nothing is meant as an attack. Spoiler warning.
AUDIO: Audio quality sounded fine on my 2.0 system. when the Reliant is coming around Regula to chase the Enterprise the audio transition between the two pieces of music did not work right, but it may have been the only option. The shot of the Reliant coming at the camera (just before spock says “they are reducing speed”), the music looping there could have been better. I felt that certain scenes were too quiet and others were too loud. When chapter 8 came in the music builds and then almost immediately dies off, the music there could have been left out entirely.
7 out of 10
VIDEO: The picture is letterboxed, but me and my regular tv didn’t mind :smile: . Image quality did not seem on par with the special edition dvd. I noticed a blip frame at around 1:12:52 between the shot of Uhura looking at the viewscreen and the shot of the damaged Reliant.
7 out of 10
Editing: When Chekov comes onto the bridge near the end offering assistance and the music continues, that worked very well. The first attack of Reliant towards Enterprise was excellent. The original series music worked wonders for the edit and helped make me believe I was watching a trek episode. It would have been nice to see a bit more Khan, not seeing very much of him now he loses some of his depth, but just hearing his last words over the comm was great. The cut where Sulu says “reliant in this sector and slowing” felt a bit forced.
8 out of 10
Entertainment: I very much enjoyed this edit of The Wrath Of Khan, it was fun. The black and white footage seen throughout from space seed ect. was very cool. Awesome title/credit sequences. Spocks funeral was classic trek, again made me feel like I was watching a genuine episode, but if it was shorter around 50-55 minutes it would have been even more convincing.
9 out of 10
Overall 8 out of 10.
On a side note, there was something about this edit, I don’t know what it was, but it reminded me of what originally attracted me to the film when I was a kid, all the fun and excitement that I had. I remembered what it was like watching it for the first time. It brought back forgotten memories of Lego Wrath of Khan re-enactments, making my friends watch the movie for the upteenth time. For that brief time I was a kid once again, a person I thought was lost, so thank you very much for that bionicbob.
Sincerely. Rogue.
This review is based on my opinions and my viewing experience. Nothing is meant as an attack. Spoiler warning.
AUDIO: Audio quality sounded fine on my 2.0 system. when the Reliant is coming around Regula to chase the Enterprise the audio transition between the two pieces of music did not work right, but it may have been the only option. The shot of the Reliant coming at the camera (just before spock says “they are reducing speed”), the music looping there could have been better. I felt that certain scenes were too quiet and others were too loud. When chapter 8 came in the music builds and then almost immediately dies off, the music there could have been left out entirely.
7 out of 10
VIDEO: The picture is letterboxed, but me and my regular tv didn’t mind :smile: . Image quality did not seem on par with the special edition dvd. I noticed a blip frame at around 1:12:52 between the shot of Uhura looking at the viewscreen and the shot of the damaged Reliant.
7 out of 10
Editing: When Chekov comes onto the bridge near the end offering assistance and the music continues, that worked very well. The first attack of Reliant towards Enterprise was excellent. The original series music worked wonders for the edit and helped make me believe I was watching a trek episode. It would have been nice to see a bit more Khan, not seeing very much of him now he loses some of his depth, but just hearing his last words over the comm was great. The cut where Sulu says “reliant in this sector and slowing” felt a bit forced.
8 out of 10
Entertainment: I very much enjoyed this edit of The Wrath Of Khan, it was fun. The black and white footage seen throughout from space seed ect. was very cool. Awesome title/credit sequences. Spocks funeral was classic trek, again made me feel like I was watching a genuine episode, but if it was shorter around 50-55 minutes it would have been even more convincing.
9 out of 10
Overall 8 out of 10.
On a side note, there was something about this edit, I don’t know what it was, but it reminded me of what originally attracted me to the film when I was a kid, all the fun and excitement that I had. I remembered what it was like watching it for the first time. It brought back forgotten memories of Lego Wrath of Khan re-enactments, making my friends watch the movie for the upteenth time. For that brief time I was a kid once again, a person I thought was lost, so thank you very much for that bionicbob.
Sincerely. Rogue.
R